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Gas on the rise again...

MaxPF

AGNTSA
Messages
1,394
Location
The dark side of the globe
Except for the Brake Fluid..My H3 has totally sythetic lubes and oils...because I want all the crude for my fuel..:neo:

LOL, you do realize that even true synthetic fluids (which most markeded "synthetics" aren't) are still derived from 100% petroleum-derived petrochemical feedstocks?

In any case, I'm still gonna burn my share too. If we're headed for the precipice, I'd rather be driving than walking :wink:
 
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Dennis

Guest
LOL, you do realize that even true synthetic fluids (which most markeded "synthetics" aren't) are still derived from 100% petroleum-derived petrochemical feedstocks?
If I'm not mistaken..I think AMSOIL is PURE synthetic, no base feedstocks..Castrol Edge is suppose to be close to pure too, but I read somwhere, they also used a Mineral Oil clone to build on..Granted though, All synthetics no matter who..All use less than a thimble of Crude oil components per 1000 gals of synthetic that is produced.


In any case, I'm still gonna burn my share too. If we're headed for the precipice, I'd rather be driving than walking
I'm with you there brother..They'll have to pry my dead fingers off my steering wheel of the Hummer before I would ever consider a Hybrid poison battery POS, ever!!!

FYI:..I know someone in the State Dept., who is very involved with the whole Mid-East BS..and As I have learned from them..With Afganistan, it is not on our hidden agenda to free the nation..but to gain favors with them so we will have an unlimited supply of their only natural resource besides Opium Poppies..and that is Lithium...
 
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MaxPF

AGNTSA
Messages
1,394
Location
The dark side of the globe
If I'm not mistaken..I think AMSOIL is PURE synthetic, no base feedstocks..Castrol Edge is suppose to be close to pure too, but I read somwhere, they also used a Mineral Oil clone to build on..Granted though, All synthetics no matter who..All use less than a thimble of Crude oil components per 1000 gals of synthetic that is produced.

I never said oils like Amsoil, which use polyalphaolefin base stocks, or Redline which uses polyolester base stocks, aren't 100% synthetics. I said that they are all created using petrochemical based feedstocks. A petrochemical based feedstock is not a distallate or a product refined directly from crude oil, they are chemicals derived from crude oil that are used as feed stocks to produce other chemicals. An example is the polyalphaolefin base oils that Amsoil uses, which are made by polymerizing alpha-olefins such as 1-hexene and 1-octene. Chemicals like 1-hexene and 1-octene are made from petroleum, either crude oil or natural gas. They could be made from non-petroleum feedstocks like biomatter and non-petroleum derived methane, but at this time they are all made from petroleum.

FYI:..I know someone in the State Dept., who is very involved with the whole Mid-East BS..and As I have learned from them..With Afganistan, it is not on our hidden agenda to free the nation..but to gain favors with them so we will have an unlimited supply of their only natural resource besides Opium Poppies..and that is Lithium...

Wouldn't surprise me. Look at the policy in Africa - supply them with "aid", which inevitably only aids the warlords in committing genocide, while the rest of the population that doesn't get murdered dies from famine and disease. All you need to do is look at the vast unexploited mineral resources of Africa to see why that policy continues.
 

DJinCO

Well-Known Member
Sadly, human nature being what it is, you can rarely count on people to do the right thing unless it is imposed upon them.

Yikes... I like to believe that many people "do the right thing" even if it is not popular.

- In any moment of decision, the best thing you can do is the right thing, the next best thing is the wrong thing, and the worst thing you can do is nothing.

- It is difficult to make our material condition better by the best law, but it is easy enough to ruin it by bad laws.

- No man is justified in doing evil on the ground of expedience.

-- Theodore Roosevelt


Nope. Lubricants are a valid use of petroleum. It makes no sense to save a few gallons of crude by using less effective lubricants just to turn around and burn hundreds of barrels as fuel in the vehicle. Wouldn't it be more logical to use petroleum-based lubricants (which are recycleable, by the way), and burn bio-based fuels instead?

Max,
I would like you to explore the web site renewablelube.com a company in Ohio that produces very high quality bio-syn lubes. Tribology is something I know about. The motor oil is a High Performance Lubricant formulated using the most advanced and newest API SN, API Resource Conserving, ILSAC GF-5, and GM dexos 1 approved additives and exceeds GF-5 requirements and meet and exceed the Original Equipment Manufactures (OEM) requirements and has proven to improve performance in new vehicles.

Bio based lubes are here, available and out perform conventional and synthetic from the major manufacturers, based on used oil analysis in daily drivers, not some test vehicle. I have been happy with the products that I use that are from Renewable Lubricants. I am getting ready to change the diff lubes in the Hummer to bio-syn. I already have some fluids that I need to use up for the transfer case and motor oil. Within 2 years the H3 will be all bio-syn lubes.
 
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Dennis

Guest
Thats the thing about Gov't imposing their will..Make us buy Battery cars..Wind and solar electricity..I can remember a couple of fiascos forced on us because the Gov't said so..

GM made diesel engine out of Gasoline engines (Cadillacs)..Banned all CFC refrigerants and made us all go with the new R-134a in cars and home refrig's..this put the industry on it's ear, costing us the consumer 5 times as much to keep cool now..Ozone hole thing is BS..Now the modern HFC refrigerants are harmless to the Ozone (supposidly) but are still considered a green house gas and will also be phased out for some other new exotic refrigerant and systems that will cost us some more. (note; I can honestly say I know what I'm talking about here, because I teach and administer the EPA exams for refrigeration technicians.)

Hybrid car batteries?..what the hell do you do with NiCa?..it is more toxic to the land and environment than lead, Mercury and spent atomic waste put together
 
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Fish

Well-Known Member
Messages
871
Location
San Diego, CA
I only skimmed the latest posts but.....I have worked on/and my employer has dumped 10's of millions on lithium-ion battery research..it's gonna be "the thing" for awhile
 

MaxPF

AGNTSA
Messages
1,394
Location
The dark side of the globe
Thats the thing about Gov't imposing their will..Make us buy Battery cars..Wind and solar electricity..I can remember a couple of fiascos forced on us because the Gov't said so..

Nothing wrong with wind and solar, but they cannot solve all of our energy needs.

GM made diesel engine out of Gasoline engines (Cadillacs)..Banned all CFC refrigerants and made us all go with the new R-134a in cars and home refrig's..this put the industry on it's ear, costing us the consumer 5 times as much to keep cool now..Ozone hole thing is BS..Now the modern HFC refrigerants are harmless to the Ozone (supposidly) but are still considered a green house gas and will also be phased out for some other new exotic refrigerant and systems that will cost us some more. (note; I can honestly say I know what I'm talking about here, because I teach and administer the EPA exams for refrigeration technicians.)

Ahem.... GM did not make diesels out of gas engines. What they did do was base their first light diesel on the Olds 350 gas engine. It did not, however, use the gas 350 parts. Bluck was much thicker, heads were designed for diesel use, as were the pistons and rest of the rotating assembly. The main problem with that engine was lack of head gasket clamping due to only having 8 head bolts per side (International would eventually have the exact same problem with the DT365, AKA the 6.0 PowerStroke, for the exact same reasons), and a piss poor fuel system design (no water separator, poor filter,, inadequate maintenance intervals). Not to mention lack of diesel training for the GM service techs. GM ended up having their Detroit Diesel division design a replacement, which we now know as the 6.2L diesel, which eventually became the 6.5L. The 6.2 was a solid design, although GM shortcutted the block and head metallurgy for cost savings which lead to occasional block web failure. Still, the failure percentage was fairly low, and they were generally good, reliable, fuel efficient, but underpowered, engines.

The ozone thing is not BS. I used to think that too, but the science is pretty hard to refute (unlike anthropogenic global warming). Heck, CFC's have been known stratospheric ozone depleters since the 50's. My big complaint is that they replaced them with other halocarbons (HFC-134a), and now they want to go to yet another even less efficient halocarbons (HFO-1234yf, which is a fluorinated olefin). I think this is all because halocarbons are huge revenue makers for big chemical companies. Hydrocarbon refrigerants are much more efficient, ridiculously cheap, no ODB, very low GWP, and the flammability concerns are BS. But, there is no profit in it.

Hybrid car batteries?..what the hell do you do with NiCa?..it is more toxic to the land and environment than lead, Mercury and spent atomic waste put together

Hybrids and electric cars have never used NiCd's. Early attempts in the 90's used NiMH, but they are too heavy and lack energy density. That is why all modern hybrids and electrics use lithium chemistry batteries. They are light, although energy density still sucks compared to liquid fuels. I always said that if an electric vehicle had the same range as it's gasoline/diesel counterparts, same performance, reasonable recharging times (say, 20 minutes MAX, under 10 minutes would be better), the same cost, the batteries had the same longevity as a modern gas or diesel engine with comparable replacement costs, and there were electric recharging stations everywhere that we currently have gas filling stations, THEN I would own an electric vehicle in a heartbeat. I'm not going to hold my breath though...
 
D

Dennis

Guest
Nothing wrong with wind and solar, but they cannot solve all of our energy needs.



Ahem.... GM did not make diesels out of gas engines. What they did do was base their first light diesel on the Olds 350 gas engine. It did not, however, use the gas 350 parts. Bluck was much thicker, heads were designed for diesel use, as were the pistons and rest of the rotating assembly. The main problem with that engine was lack of head gasket clamping due to only having 8 head bolts per side (International would eventually have the exact same problem with the DT365, AKA the 6.0 PowerStroke, for the exact same reasons), and a piss poor fuel system design (no water separator, poor filter,, inadequate maintenance intervals). Not to mention lack of diesel training for the GM service techs. GM ended up having their Detroit Diesel division design a replacement, which we now know as the 6.2L diesel, which eventually became the 6.5L. The 6.2 was a solid design, although GM shortcutted the block and head metallurgy for cost savings which lead to occasional block web failure. Still, the failure percentage was fairly low, and they were generally good, reliable, fuel efficient, but underpowered, engines.

The ozone thing is not BS. I used to think that too, but the science is pretty hard to refute (unlike anthropogenic global warming). Heck, CFC's have been known stratospheric ozone depleters since the 50's. My big complaint is that they replaced them with other halocarbons (HFC-134a), and now they want to go to yet another even less efficient halocarbons (HFO-1234yf, which is a fluorinated olefin). I think this is all because halocarbons are huge revenue makers for big chemical companies. Hydrocarbon refrigerants are much more efficient, ridiculously cheap, no ODB, very low GWP, and the flammability concerns are BS. But, there is no profit in it.



Hybrids and electric cars have never used NiCd's. Early attempts in the 90's used NiMH, but they are too heavy and lack energy density. That is why all modern hybrids and electrics use lithium chemistry batteries. They are light, although energy density still sucks compared to liquid fuels. I always said that if an electric vehicle had the same range as it's gasoline/diesel counterparts, same performance, reasonable recharging times (say, 20 minutes MAX, under 10 minutes would be better), the same cost, the batteries had the same longevity as a modern gas or diesel engine with comparable replacement costs, and there were electric recharging stations everywhere that we currently have gas filling stations, THEN I would own an electric vehicle in a heartbeat. I'm not going to hold my breath though...
WOW! way too much information, you don't have to prove anything to me..I see you're just full of it:)..Very good information that is, not many know about the replacement for R-410A being R-1234yf..Hydroflorinated that is, and other than some editorial based on your own opinions..I'm impressed with your knowledge...

Per what Fish said...I guess G.A. in California is working on making the lithium-ion a better battery..

Sorry, I'm not trusting a battery anyways, nor do I like the sound or lack there of, of them, and the idea some toys are only powered by batteries, I don't want my car to be in the same class...give me the INTERNAL COMBUSTION ENGINE anyday..even if it has to run on soybean fuel.
 
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Dennis

Guest
Back on topic..Speaking of Gas

[video=youtube;epjrWjo9ZMY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epjrWjo9ZMY&feature=related[/video]
 
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