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  1. #3031
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPaul View Post
    You mean the guy that spent too much time and money trying to add locking hubs to a vehicle that wasn't designed for them and then apparently very quickly ended up blowing them up on the trail (like a few of us said he would) and we never heard from him again? Frankly if he had just gone the route you're taking he would have been better off and the money he would have saved with this setup rather than those custom and fragile hubs of his he would have come out ahead financially since he would not have ever saved enough gas with that setup to compensate for the cost of doing all that to his truck.

    At least with this mod you're not spending thousands on custom crap that you won't be able to find at an Autozone or NAPA if it decides to go out on you. I didn't see you mention it though but you do know you'll have to drive around with the center diff locked in order to be able to go anywhere while the front axle is unlocked with this mod, right? If the center diff is unlocked (4HI unlocked) you'll just sit and spin the front drive shaft while the rear drive shaft won't move an inch. In 4HI locked the center diff that is in the transfer case is locked so that both the front and rear driveshaft will spin together, regardless of what is going on in the front or rear diffs.

    The Colorado guys don't have that problem because their transfer case is designed differently and there is no center differential in it, so when the transfer case is in 2wd mode only the rear driveshaft is being driven, and when you put it in 4wd it engages the front driveshaft as well. The center differential in our transfer case is necessary for full time 4WD to work on pavement as the front and rear driveshafts have to be able to turn at different rates when taking turns and other similar maneuvers. However this means that if any part of the front drivetrain is no longer operational (broken or disconnected front driveshaft, differential, or axles) then you simply stop moving when in 4HI unlocked. Same thing happens if you were driving on a loose surface and 3 of your tires have grip but the 4th tire loses grip. You won't go anywhere until the traction control kicks in and tries to stop the spinning wheel from moving using the brakes. In 4HI locked you can have one tire lose traction and still move forward. once 2 tires lose traction (1 on each axle) you stop moving again unless you have locking front and/or rear differentials.


    It's not a big deal to leave the center diff locked, but I think you're adding complexity and additional points of failure that don't need to be there for a benefit that is highly dubious at best and historically proven to be absent. You're not changing how much mass has to be moved/rotated by the engine with this setup so you won't see any improvement in MPG or power. You would have to replace the transfer case with one that is designed for part-time 4wd (or pay who knows how much money for that custom bit the locking hubs guy used) in order to see any potential (though still minuscule) benefits. Your H3 and feel free to mod away, but the whole 2wd vs full time 4wd thing has been hashed over several times on here. It's also been a topic of discussion for years around the internet and I have as of yet to see anyone with proof that a part time 4wd vehicle gets better gas mileage than a full time 4wd vehicle.
    You make an excellent point and gave me something to think about with the T-case in high lock. I think someone said here the T-case is a 40/60 split in power. It never really clicked with me until you said to go any where in this 2WD mode, the T-case has to be in high.

    I was hoping you would have forgotten about the guy with the hubs and blowing them out on his first trip lol. I remembered that and was hoping with unlocking the front axle, I wouldn't have to worry about that.

    Now question, something I was thinking about with the guys that go with SAS, don't they have to drive in 4x4 high as well when then unlock their hubs? None of them had said anything about MPG better, that should have been my first indication that is a hard NO-GO. I really don't want to mess around with my T-case to make this work. This is more of a "what if" I try this kinda thing. I love how the T drives and knowing she'll take care of me, no matter where I'm at. Last thing I want to do is introduce variables of failure points.

    I've done a lot of homework on this subject and I can see that it wasn't enough.

    With my MPG, I could do a lot worse but I'm hovering at 13 on the street and 17 on the highway. Not great, but who buys these thing for MPG. Now that it's winter and I love to hop in a warm truck, my last tank gave me 200 miles with a fill up of 26 gallons. Don't do that math... the numbers are horrible.

    One thing that has always been a mystery to me, this axle locking actuator lock the axles, duh. But how? It's just on the drive side, wouldn't that only unlock one wheel seeing how the other one is still locked in the diff? So rather than making this 2WD, now I'm in 3WD.

    Like you said, the 355 guys have a 4x4 T-case sending 100% of the power to the rear axle when in 2WD. I've seen tons of videos about the axle actuator locking both wheels, but still having a hard time trying to understand the passenger side wheel.

    The CV axle is in the diff, so how would the passenger side get unlocked?
    No one is more professional than I. I am a Noncommissioned Officer, a leader of Soldiers.

  2. #3032
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    If Im not mistaken, when both front wheels are in the air and you spin one side forward, the opposite side will spin backwards. The disconnect will allow the same thing to happen internally.

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    06 H3, Birch White, Lux , Cooper AT3 35s, Borla Performance Cat-back, Bilsteins front w/ 1/2" extended stops, Hunner sleeve, Air Doc w/ K&N filter, Oem Roof lights, 55W HID Headlights and 35W Fog lights.

    09 H3 V8, Arctic Silver, LS376/480 Conversion, 3000 stall, Custom E-fans, 37" KM3 tires, XD Rockstar Wheels 17x9, OEM Sliders, 40K External Trans Cooler, Bilstein 5160s front 5100 rear, O.D. Steering Bracket, 2" Body Lift, Custom Exhaust, Custom intake pipe & K&N filter, Custom PCM tune, Pioneer DVD unit, Aurora 40" LED Light Bar, 50 W HID Headlights

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  4. #3033
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    I will never forget the locking hubs guy, shame he wasted all that time and money on something that ended up being snake oil. They might have been fine for driving around on dirt roads or in the wet, but that's it.

    Here's a description of how the CAD works:

    "A center axle disconnect system or CAD is an alternative to locking hubs. CAD systems are typically used in front drive axles on four wheel drive vehicles. A CAD system works by having an axle shaft (typically the longer shaft) split into two pieces. One piece is connected to the carrier, the other connected to the wheel. This reduces drag on the axle by allowing only the spider and side gears to spin, while the differential carrier, pinion and drive shaft are at rest (as is the inner portion of the disconnected long shaft and its associated side gear). The axle is engaged by connecting the two split axle shafts. The ends of the axles are typically splined and use a collar to connect the two shafts together by sliding over both shafts."

    Only reason that works that way is with part time 4wd transfer cases when they are in 2wd mode the drive chain and front output are disengaged completely so nothing is really trying to spin the front driveshaft, including the front wheels, so it just sits there. The front wheels are able to freely spin independent of each other, and the side that is still hooked to the differential only acts on the spider gears inside the diff, the amount of force needed to also spin the diff itself and the front driveshaft is far more than the force needed to spin the spider gears. It might spin a little bit due to friction but it will be very, very slowly.

    Since our transfercase always tries to spin the front output it means even with the CAD you're still spinning everything just as much as if you didn't add the CAD. Since there is a differential inside the transfer case (this is what gives it the ability to be full time 4wd even on pavement without blowing up the drivetrain) when the front driveline becomes disconnected in any way the front output will have less force required to spin it than the rear so you'll just sit there and go nowhere. The center diff needs to be locked to force the front and rear to spin together no matter what. The whole 40/60 split is a bit of BS in my opinion. It all depends on how much traction either end has as to how much power will go to it. There is nothing controlling how much power is sent tot the front vs the rear aside from weight transfer during acceleration and traction between the tires and the road.

    The CAD is the better option compared to custom locking hubs since it is far cheaper and a million times easier to get parts for it fast, but you still have to modify or swap the transfer case to make it worthwhile at all.

    In the end though, that particular CAD was designed for a much lighter truck with smaller wheels/tires than the H3. If they are blowing them up in the Colorado's then you'll definitely blow it in the heavier H3, especially if you're running 35's or larger. Our front drivetrain is already considered a bit weak, so adding something from a lightweight vehicle seems like it will be a lot more trouble than it is worth. I would imagine the Colorado guys are probably swapping out their CAD and transfercase for our parts to eliminate that point of failure, and give themselves full time 4wd. I know I would if it was me.

    Honestly I would suggest dropping the whole 2wd idea and just be glad to have a truck with good full time 4wd. The SFA guys are either modding/swapping the transfer case, putting it in 4HI locked, or just keeping the hubs locked all the time and continuing to drive in full time 4wd. But it is your rig and if you want to try it out, go for it. It's a lot less capital and time invested than trying to do something ridiculous like locking hubs on something that was never designed to accommodate them.
    2008 H3 Alpha

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  6. #3034
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    Quote Originally Posted by JPaul View Post
    I will never forget the locking hubs guy, shame he wasted all that time and money on something that ended up being snake oil. They might have been fine for driving around on dirt roads or in the wet, but that's it.

    Here's a description of how the CAD works:

    "A center axle disconnect system or CAD is an alternative to locking hubs. CAD systems are typically used in front drive axles on four wheel drive vehicles. A CAD system works by having an axle shaft (typically the longer shaft) split into two pieces. One piece is connected to the carrier, the other connected to the wheel. This reduces drag on the axle by allowing only the spider and side gears to spin, while the differential carrier, pinion and drive shaft are at rest (as is the inner portion of the disconnected long shaft and its associated side gear). The axle is engaged by connecting the two split axle shafts. The ends of the axles are typically splined and use a collar to connect the two shafts together by sliding over both shafts."

    Only reason that works that way is with part time 4wd transfer cases when they are in 2wd mode the drive chain and front output are disengaged completely so nothing is really trying to spin the front driveshaft, including the front wheels, so it just sits there. The front wheels are able to freely spin independent of each other, and the side that is still hooked to the differential only acts on the spider gears inside the diff, the amount of force needed to also spin the diff itself and the front driveshaft is far more than the force needed to spin the spider gears. It might spin a little bit due to friction but it will be very, very slowly.

    Since our transfercase always tries to spin the front output it means even with the CAD you're still spinning everything just as much as if you didn't add the CAD. Since there is a differential inside the transfer case (this is what gives it the ability to be full time 4wd even on pavement without blowing up the drivetrain) when the front driveline becomes disconnected in any way the front output will have less force required to spin it than the rear so you'll just sit there and go nowhere. The center diff needs to be locked to force the front and rear to spin together no matter what. The whole 40/60 split is a bit of BS in my opinion. It all depends on how much traction either end has as to how much power will go to it. There is nothing controlling how much power is sent tot the front vs the rear aside from weight transfer during acceleration and traction between the tires and the road.

    The CAD is the better option compared to custom locking hubs since it is far cheaper and a million times easier to get parts for it fast, but you still have to modify or swap the transfer case to make it worthwhile at all.

    In the end though, that particular CAD was designed for a much lighter truck with smaller wheels/tires than the H3. If they are blowing them up in the Colorado's then you'll definitely blow it in the heavier H3, especially if you're running 35's or larger. Our front drivetrain is already considered a bit weak, so adding something from a lightweight vehicle seems like it will be a lot more trouble than it is worth. I would imagine the Colorado guys are probably swapping out their CAD and transfercase for our parts to eliminate that point of failure, and give themselves full time 4wd. I know I would if it was me.

    Honestly I would suggest dropping the whole 2wd idea and just be glad to have a truck with good full time 4wd. The SFA guys are either modding/swapping the transfer case, putting it in 4HI locked, or just keeping the hubs locked all the time and continuing to drive in full time 4wd. But it is your rig and if you want to try it out, go for it. It's a lot less capital and time invested than trying to do something ridiculous like locking hubs on something that was never designed to accommodate them.
    Bet, thanks for the boat load of info I was missing out on lol. I'm happy with my T as is, no need to do something like this with not much of an MPG improvement.

    Really, thank you!
    No one is more professional than I. I am a Noncommissioned Officer, a leader of Soldiers.

  7. #3035
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    Glad I could help. Many times I have thought something sounded like a good idea, until I either tried to actually implement it and realized it was a terrible idea, or someone else pointed out what could go wrong with it. We all start somewhere and having others around that know more than us can be immensely helpful with the learning process.
    2008 H3 Alpha

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  8. #3036
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    Drilled a hole

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  9. #3037
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    Back to the comments about the 2wd transfer case-- I can tell you from a 3000 mile trip a couple years back that you will gain exactly 0mpg with the front axle disconnected. It's certainly your truck and I fully support doing whatever you want, but if gaining mileage is your goal, you'll be disappointed.

  10. #3038
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    So any updates on this?
    Last edited by amrg; 12-16-2020 at 12:26 PM.
    06 H3, Birch White, Lux , Cooper AT3 35s, Borla Performance Cat-back, Bilsteins front w/ 1/2" extended stops, Hunner sleeve, Air Doc w/ K&N filter, Oem Roof lights, 55W HID Headlights and 35W Fog lights.

    09 H3 V8, Arctic Silver, LS376/480 Conversion, 3000 stall, Custom E-fans, 37" KM3 tires, XD Rockstar Wheels 17x9, OEM Sliders, 40K External Trans Cooler, Bilstein 5160s front 5100 rear, O.D. Steering Bracket, 2" Body Lift, Custom Exhaust, Custom intake pipe & K&N filter, Custom PCM tune, Pioneer DVD unit, Aurora 40" LED Light Bar, 50 W HID Headlights

  11. #3039
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    Quote Originally Posted by amrg View Post
    So any updates on this?
    As in the Colorado tube thing? I'm more likely going to hold onto the parts and let them gather dust lol.
    No one is more professional than I. I am a Noncommissioned Officer, a leader of Soldiers.

  12. #3040
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    Quote Originally Posted by 08H3 View Post
    Back to the comments about the 2wd transfer case-- I can tell you from a 3000 mile trip a couple years back that you will gain exactly 0mpg with the front axle disconnected. It's certainly your truck and I fully support doing whatever you want, but if gaining mileage is your goal, you'll be disappointed.
    I hear ya, sucks but it was a nice thought lol. I literally have nothing else to do her, maybe cam and supercharger. Which will more likely never happen because I'm not trying to kill my mileage.

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    No one is more professional than I. I am a Noncommissioned Officer, a leader of Soldiers.

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  14. #3041
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    Recently replaced the battery. I drilled out the sunroof grommets last weekend due to crazy amounts of water all of a sudden (passenger side was a bitch) and I replaced my radiator yesterday, 83k. It was cracked on the top front plastic to the right of the rad cap. Seems like I’ve been doing a lot lately but it’s all worth it!

  15. #3042
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    Ordered new shoes for it last week, the 33" Duratracs have lived a full life after 6 years, 2 H3's, and I don't know for sure how many tens of thousands of miles.

    Now that I don't have to drive it every day I figure it's time for something a little more aggressive. Ended up going with 35" General Tire Grabber X3's. They're supposed to be pretty decent in the snow for a MT and all the reviews of them I found were mostly good overall so we'll give them a shot.

    They're either on backorder or really far away from where I live. I ended up ordering through Discount Tire and they're having to get them sent from Georgia, so they'll be here either late this week or sometime next week.

    Also finally started working on getting the ARB lockers hooked up. I ran the hardlines yesterday and had to run around doing errands today, including getting some more fittings and a tap and die for 1/8" NPT to fix the cheap fittings I had ordered earlier this year. Hopefully tomorrow I can finish hooking them up and get the wiring for the compressor hooked up to the SwitchPro. I'd love to be able to go try the new tires out up in the mountains up the street from my house and would like to also have the lockers all hooked up for that.
    2008 H3 Alpha

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  16. #3043
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    Got festive. Merry Christmas H4O!
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    09 H3 Alpha / SAS / Adventure / Lux

  17. #3044
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    That's awesome! I did something similar years ago. Was quickly surrounded by two city cops and a sheriff's deputy. Got a big lecture about illegal use of colored lights and how I was probably confusing all the other motorists by impersonating a police car. Geez...someone had no Christmas spirit that year.

  18. #3045
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    Quote Originally Posted by Korby7 View Post
    Got festive. Merry Christmas H4O!
    Merry Christmas!!!


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